"Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  News Hawk on Fri Sep 18, 2015 7:10 pm

WHL wrote:What a perfect day on the lake!  We had a chance to have a short ride today and it was unbelievable for Sept!!

Oh no!

Shocked

The curse of saying "unbelievable ride in September!!"

Not the usual boat, but I saw your boat—someone waved—but didn't respond in time.

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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  News Hawk on Fri Sep 18, 2015 7:16 pm

obervantone wrote:Your story is changing again.

Initially you wrote:
It's-Not-News-Hawk:
my own boat struck BP rocky bottom on the western shoreline. The cause? An over-sized Fountain going through BP at about 50-MPH

Now the story is beginning to evolve.
It's-Not-News-Hawk wrote:
​​•​ ​I was virtually motionless, and well off the center of the BP channel!
So which is it?  
You were either terrified by a powerboat going past you on plane while you were "well off the center of the BP channel!" and you ran your boat aground,
Or...
You were "virtually motionless" in the BP and allowed your boat to drift into the shallows and hit rocks rather than fire up your auxiliary engine and move back into open water.  

Which is it?

My follow up question, given your inconsistency and propensity for exaggeration and your inclination to blame others for your admitted poor seamanship skills, if the powerboat frightened you to the point that it forced you into the shallows where you went aground and struck rocks, did you pick up your radio or cellphone and report the offender to the Marine Patrol?

I think we all know the answer to that question.

This was my sailboat, with a 4-foot draft, in six feet of water, just 15 feet off the shoreline. The wake caused the daggerboard to strike the bottom.

Since I was there, I have perfect recollection. The efforts to stop the NWZ did a disservice to smaller boats, and those who must dig out the bottom from under their docked boat this time of year.

(And why FATP has this thread:
http://winnipesaukee.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19843 ).

sunny

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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  WHL on Fri Sep 18, 2015 8:02 pm

The usual boat is out of commission this summer .. Put it in only to take it out for repairs to the bottom. We haven't gotten it back yet. Or do u mean the big boat. So that was u on the dock?
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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  obervantone on Fri Sep 18, 2015 8:53 pm

It's-Not-News-Hawk wrote:
my sailboat, with a 4-foot draft, in six feet of water, just 15 feet off the shoreline
Which scenario was it...

Scenario #1 you were terrified and sailed to within 15 feet of the shoreline (a little close, no?)  
Gee, I wonder what your reaction would have been if someone came that close to your shoreline.    Shocked

Or Scenario #2 your boat was adrift went into the shallows and you failed to use your auxiliary engine to get back into open water.

You also ignored my follow up question...if the big bad powerboat scared you and caused you to run aground trying to get away, did you contact the Marine Patrol.

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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  News Hawk on Fri Sep 18, 2015 9:28 pm

obervantone wrote:Scenario #1 you were terrified and sailed to within 15 feet of the shoreline (a little close, no?)  
Gee,  I wonder what your reaction would have been if someone came that close to your shoreline.    Shocked
Not terrified, except of getting swamped.

As to "close to my shoreline", fishermen do it all the time—even casting hooked plugs across our dock and folded sails.

Rolling Eyes

obervantone wrote:Or Scenario #2 your boat was adrift went into the shallows and you failed to use your auxiliary engine to get back into open water.

scratch 

I have no engine at all.

obervantone wrote:You also ignored my follow up question...if the big bad powerboat scared you and caused you to run aground trying to get away, did you contact the Marine Patrol.

I was in an unpowered sailboat—effectively becalmednot "run-aground".

Rolling Eyes

This is the circumstance that day and why the NWZ was desirable. If I'd had a video camera, I could demonstrate the effects of a loud exhaust amplified echoing between the mainland and Cow Island:



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Last edited by News Hawk on Sat Sep 19, 2015 5:55 am; edited 2 times in total
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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  obervantone on Fri Sep 18, 2015 10:20 pm

It's-Not-News-Hawk wrote:
I have no engine at all.
No alternative source of power...like a paddle?  That's pretty short sighted for a old salt like yourself
It's-Not-News-Hawk wrote:
I was in an unpowered sailboat—and becalmed—not "running aground".
And yet you claim that a powerboat on plane was able to cause your contact with rocks.
It's-Not-News-Hawk:
my own boat struck BP rocky bottom on the western shoreline. The cause? An over-sized Fountain going through BP at about 50-MPH
Had nothing at all to do with the fact you were 15 feet from shore giving yourself only a foot or so of water under your keel.
.  
It's-Not-News-Hawk wrote:
OO wrote:
Gee,  I wonder what your reaction would have been if someone came that close to your shoreline.  
Fishermen do it all the time.
I'll take a swing by next time I'm in Winter Harbor to see what your reaction is .

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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  News Hawk on Sat Sep 19, 2015 6:06 am

Mr. Tone wrote:

It's-Not-News-Hawk wrote:
I have no engine at all.

Mr. Tone wrote: No alternative source of power...like a paddle?  That's pretty short sighted for a old salt like yourself.

Regardless of what boat I'm using, I always carry a paddle—right at hand.

Cool

Mr. Tone wrote:
It's-Not-News-Hawk wrote:
I was in an unpowered sailboat—and becalmed—not "running aground".
And yet you claim that a powerboat on plane was able to cause your contact with rocks.
It's-Not-News-Hawk:
my own boat struck BP rocky bottom on the western shoreline. The cause? An over-sized Fountain going through BP at about 50-MPH

Mr. Tone wrote:

Had nothing at all to do with the fact you were 15 feet from shore giving yourself only a foot or so of water under your keel.

The six feet of water was sufficient for a sailboat drawing four feet; that is, unless encountering an oversized boat wake. A NWZ would have been an especially good thing for Cow Island residents. (IF the scofflaws obeyed such regulations).  

Mr. Tone wrote:

It's-Not-News-Hawk wrote:
OO wrote:
Gee,  I wonder what your reaction would have been if someone came that close to your shoreline.  
Fishermen do it all the time.

Mr. Tone wrote:

I'll take a swing by next time I'm in Winter Harbor to see what your reaction is .
Usually, it's family or guests who respond unfavorably—I've seen it all before—although only in recent years.

Rolling Eyes

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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  News Hawk on Sat Sep 19, 2015 9:49 am

obervantone wrote:I'll take a swing by next time I'm in Winter Harbor to see what your reaction is .
To those who live on quiet Winter Harbor?

Don't make it too early: one family member flapped her arms like a bird to an old guy on a Jet-Ski because it was too soon after 6-AM for the usual visitor-invader-weekend-noise to start.

He waved back, [impossible not] to notice that he was getting "two thumbs down".

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Another review for those with comprehension issues

Post  obervantone on Sat Sep 19, 2015 12:24 pm

It's-Not-News-Hawk wrote:
Mr. Tone wrote: No alternative source of power...like a paddle?  That's pretty short sighted for a old salt like yourself.

Regardless of what boat I'm using, I always carry a paddle—right at hand.
Then you did have an alternative power source and were able to get yourself out of the shallows, but chose not to.

It's-Not-News-Hawk:
my own boat struck BP rocky bottom on the western shoreline. The cause? An over-sized Fountain going through BP at about 50-MPH

Mr. Tone wrote:
Had nothing at all to do with the fact you were 15 feet from shore giving yourself only a foot or so of water under your keel.

The six feet of water was sufficient for a sailboat drawing four feet; that is, unless encountering an oversized boat wake.
You admit you allowed your boat to enter an area where there was insufficient water for safe passage, and still you blame others for your negligent operation of your vessel.  Being in 6 feet of water in a boat that draws 4 feet only leaves a scant foot or so under your keel (given the action of waves).  It is no wonder you ran aground.

It's-Not-News-Hawk wrote:
obervantone wrote:
I'll take a swing by next time I'm in Winter Harbor to see what your reaction is .
Don't make it too early: one family member flapped her arms like a bird to an old guy on a Jet-Ski because it was too soon after 6-AM for the usual visitor-invader-weekend-noise to start.
I was unaware that the State of New Hampshire has imposed a curfew on Lake Winnipesaukee, could you please provide the RSA number?....What's that?   Oh  making stuff up again...

Bottom line, you continue to blame others for your poor seamanship skills.  You never should have let your vessel get into shallows that would allow it to strike rocks because of wave action and now you predictably blame someone else.  The onus is on you!


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"Consideration" is a Lost Cause to Speedboaters...

Post  News Hawk on Sat Sep 19, 2015 7:51 pm

obervantone wrote:
It's-Not-News-Hawk wrote:
Mr. Tone wrote: No alternative source of power...like a paddle?  That's pretty short sighted for a old salt like yourself.

Regardless of what boat I'm using, I always carry a paddle—right at hand.

Then you did have an alternative power source and were able to get yourself out of the shallows, but chose not to.

News Hawk wrote:Six feet isn't "shallows". I've got four feet minimum at my dock—eight feet maximum—whilst averaging six feet. 'Plenty of room.

A paddle is handy, acting as a boat hook or a slow means of manual propulsion. "Alternative power" is not an "auxiliary engine".

It's-Not-News-Hawk:
my own boat struck BP rocky bottom on the western shoreline. The cause? An over-sized Fountain going through BP at about 50-MPH

Mr. Tone wrote:
Had nothing at all to do with the fact you were 15 feet from shore giving yourself only a foot or so of water under your keel.

The six feet of water was sufficient for a sailboat drawing four feet; that is, unless encountering an oversized boat wake.

You admit you allowed your boat to enter an area where there was insufficient water for safe passage, and still you blame others for your negligent operation of your vessel.  Being in 6 feet of water in a boat that draws 4 feet only leaves a scant foot or so under your keel (given the action of waves).  It is no wonder you ran aground.

News Hawk wrote:"Ran aground " doesn't describe a motionless boat's actions. There was plenty of water depth below my sailboat, which only draws a few inches with the board up. The wake caused both my boat to rapidly rise and fall, with the lake's bottom pushing the daggerboard up about a foot. No damage, but experienced a very negative consequence of an oversized boat "driver's" inconsiderate operation.  

It's-Not-News-Hawk wrote:
obervantone wrote:
I'll take a swing by next time I'm in Winter Harbor to see what your reaction is .
Don't make it too early: one family member flapped her arms like a bird to an old guy on a Jet-Ski because it was too soon after 6-AM for the usual visitor-invader-weekend-noise to start.
I was unaware that the State of New Hampshire has imposed a curfew on Lake Winnipesaukee, could you please provide the RSA number?....What's that?   Oh  making stuff up again...

News Hawk wrote:"Curfew"? How about a little consideration for those still sleeping, or disturbing the peaceful time of the morning with the Winnipesaukee sun arising—"The Smile of the Great Spirit".  

[/b]
obervantone wrote: Bottom line, you continue to blame others for your poor seamanship skills.  You never should have let your vessel get into shallows that would allow it to strike rocks because of wave action and now you predictably blame someone else.  The onus is on you!

News Hawk wrote:The onus is over—there was no damage, but the experience instilled in me the consequences of inconsiderate speedboaters whose visits to "The Quiet Side" of Lake Winnipesaukee are becoming increasingly unwelcome.

Evil or Very Mad

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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  obervantone on Sat Sep 19, 2015 10:12 pm

There is always another excuse with you. You always blame someone else. 

You allowed your boat to be in shallows...yes, shallows for your boat, then blame someone else when you run aground.

Your vessel was not docked or at anchor so it was "underway not making way" and went aground under YOUR command.

Stop your whining and take responsibility for your bad judgement and poor seamanship skills.

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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  News Hawk on Sun Sep 20, 2015 5:47 am

obervantone wrote:There is always another excuse with you.  You always blame someone else. 

You allowed your boat to be in shallows...yes, shallows for your boat, then blame someone else when you run aground.

Your vessel was not docked or at anchor so it was "underway not making way" and went aground under YOUR command.

Stop your whining and take responsibility for your bad judgement and poor seamanship skills.

​​• "Running-aground" by the above definitions is a pretty common experience on Lake Winnipesaukee—as the frequent sightings of the "propeller-repair-truck" (from Maine) attests. Coming away from an oversized boat wake without damage means I was fortunate (and, at least, not soaked).

​​• It helps to learn good seamanship in basic small boats, where inconsiderate "drivers" can teach you the grim lessons on how to develop one's "Defensive-Boating" techniques. A credit card and a key are not lessons.
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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  obervantone on Sun Sep 20, 2015 5:21 pm

Exactly, it is ALWAYS someone else's fault when it comes to you.  

They obviously boarded your vessel and directed it to within 15 feet of the shoreline with only a foot or so of water under your keel, then caused the wind to stop so that they could cause your boat to run aground and hit rock when the waves kicked up.

We all got it...it's always THEM...never YOU.

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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  WHL on Sun Sep 20, 2015 5:57 pm

I think it's Bush's fault!!!!
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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  obervantone on Sun Sep 20, 2015 11:50 pm

I was thinking Romney, he's got the place in Wolfeboro. Razz

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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  WHL on Mon Sep 21, 2015 7:09 am

Good thought, but Bush is usually the one who takes the blame.
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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  News Hawk on Mon Sep 21, 2015 7:15 am

Did you happen to catch the NHMP with his blue lights flashing Sunday night? He was all over Winter Harbor for about ten minutes about 8:00. He must've gotten a call, but couldn't find the infraction in an empty harbor.

scratch

There was a night-time scofflaw earlier, who "drove" his boat in the darkness—faster than allowed by law.

No

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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  WHL on Mon Sep 21, 2015 7:28 am

I remember seeing someone being stopped for a LONG time, I thought it was SAt. though.

The steam is really coming off the lake this morning.
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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  News Hawk on Mon Sep 21, 2015 8:35 am

WHL wrote:I remember seeing someone being stopped for a LONG time, I thought it was SAt. though.  

Yes, it could have been Saturday. I checked my camera for the last photo taken—which was a video of that officer's racing around. Strange, though, that I didn't use my camera even once on Sunday.

scratch

That steam is an indication we should take the last swim of the season—before the water gets too cold.

drunken

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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  News Hawk on Mon Sep 21, 2015 8:40 am

obervantone wrote:Exactly, it is ALWAYS someone else's fault when it comes to you.  

They obviously boarded your vessel and directed it to within 15 feet of the shoreline with only a foot or so of water under your keel, then caused the wind to stop so that they could cause your boat to run aground and hit rock when the waves kicked up.

We all got it...it's always THEM...never YOU.

As I reported to FATP, NHMP's Lt. Dunleavey states that there is a difference between "waves" and "wakes". A boater is financially responsible for damage from his wake.

Twisted Evil

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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  obervantone on Mon Sep 21, 2015 11:33 am

It's-Not-News-Hawk wrote:

obervantone wrote:
Exactly, it is ALWAYS someone else's fault when it comes to you.

They obviously boarded your vessel and directed it to within 15 feet of the shoreline with only a foot or so of water under your keel, then caused the wind to stop so that they could cause your boat to run aground and hit rock when the waves kicked up.

We all got it...it's always THEM...never YOU.
As I reported to FATP, NHMP's Lt. Dunleavey states that there is a difference between "waves" and "wakes". A boater is financially responsible for damage from his wake.
Yes there is, but the reaction to a boat that draws 4 feet when there is only a foot or so of water under the keel is the same. YOU allowed YOUR vessel to become in a potentially dangerous situation and YOU BLAME OTHERS for YOUR INCOMPETENCE.


Don't worry though, the WHAAAAMBULANCE is on it's way.

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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  WHL on Mon Sep 21, 2015 12:37 pm

Was it one of the old boats? The old white ones, not the pontoon type? That's what I saw.
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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  News Hawk on Mon Sep 21, 2015 8:45 pm

WHL wrote:Was it one of the old boats?  The old white ones, not the pontoon type?  That's what I saw.  

By "old boat", you mean the older NHMP boats, with the inboard?

scratch

'Haven't seen one for years.

cyclops

Because of the distance, and darkness, I couldn't tell which of the NHMP boats it was—all I saw (and recorded) was a sharply weaving, and rapidly-moving, flashing-blue light. I'll check the video later.

He could have entered the harbor an hour previously, but the "chase" started (with the light, anyway) from SE to NW.

(But dark enough for the NHMP to run RADAR).

Twisted Evil

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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  News Hawk on Mon Sep 21, 2015 8:48 pm

obervantone wrote:Yes there is, but the reaction to a boat that draws 4 feet when there is only a foot or so of water under the keel is the same.  YOU allowed YOUR vessel to become in a potentially dangerous situation and YOU BLAME OTHERS for YOUR INCOMPETENCE.  Don't worry though,  the WHAAAAMBULANCE is on it's way.  

Others "incompetence" has their motionless boats tied at 4-feet of water at their docks.

Rolling Eyes

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Re: "Visitor" Invades Quiet Winter Harbor...

Post  WHL on Tue Sep 22, 2015 7:18 am

I know, I haven't seen one of those boats for quite a while until the past month and a half or so. I wonder why they got it out again? Not the big ones, the smaller ones but the white fiberglass.
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