Senate Report On CIA Torture

Brutality, ineffectiveness and dishonesty, brought to us by Bush and Cheney!!

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/senate-report-on-cia-program-details-brutality-dishonesty/2014/12/09/1075c726-7f0e-11e4-9f38-95a187e4c1f7_story.html

Nah, what is disgusting is this is a political distraction from Grubergate.

When the WH spokesman acknowledges that it puts OUR people at risk around the world, a person of true conscience would have an issue.   It's got nothing to do with the publics' "need to know" or transparency (where was the transparency when the NSA listened in on our phone calls and farming our email addresses, and where was transparency when the IRS was killing hard drives?).

The real problem is we have people running this country that have with no grasp on reality. No country in the world would do something so stupid.
As for the report…

The two major problems and why it's not reliable:

1) Written only by Democrats. It's nothing more than a partisan witch hunt.

2) Not one single interview of those supposedly involved was conducted to gather relevant info. Not even one.

News Buzzard wrote:Brutality, ineffectiveness and dishonesty, brought to us by Bush and Cheney!!

Gotta hand it to Obama, who doesn't use torture against jihadists—the President blows them to pieces with a drone strike, along with any family members. (No torture used).




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Here is John McCain's take...but what does he know about foreign affairs or torture?  

http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/09/politics/mccain-lauds-release-terror-report/index.html

It's mind boggling that anyone could compare the stupid remarks by Gruber to the out and out illegal torture during the Bush Administration. Grubergate ended yesterday with that mindless investigation by Dayrl Issa!

It's mind boggling that anyone could compare the stupid remarks by Gruber to the out and out illegal torture during the Bush Administration

There's little common sense therefore no common ground on which to find solutions...it's futile, like herding cats.
But what I find most interesting, neither OL or NH uttered the names Bush or Cheney when responding to your post....

Common sense is never part of the equation here. It has, and always will be about bashing Obama!!

You've got that right, the next two years will be very telling....just watch what bills get brought up to committee.

News Buzzard wrote:It's mind boggling that anyone could compare the stupid remarks by Gruber to the out and out illegal torture during the Bush Administration. Grubergate ended yesterday with that mindless investigation by Dayrl Issa!

Mindless are those who believed Gruber:

The same day ObamaCare architect Jonathan "Stupid Americans" Gruber swore before Congress that there wasn't any deception involved in getting it passed, an inspector general report showed how the law continues to mislead the public. Writing off an advance copy of the report, the New York Times said the Health and Human Services IG found "half of the providers" listed as serving Medicaid patients "could not offer appointments to enrollees."
Investor's Business Daily

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On topic.....

Washington (CNN) -- The CIA's harsh interrogations of terrorist detainees during the Bush era didn't work, were more brutal than previously revealed and delivered no "ticking time bomb" information that prevented an attack, according to an explosive Senate report released Tuesday.

The majority report issued by the Senate Intelligence Committee is a damning condemnation of the tactics -- branded by critics as torture -- the George W. Bush administration deployed in the fear-laden days after the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks. The techniques, according to the report, were "deeply flawed," poorly managed and often resulted in "fabricated" information.

The long-delayed study, distilled from more than six million CIA documents, also says the agency consistently misled Congress and the Bush White House about the harsh methods it used and the results it obtained from interrogating al Qaeda suspects.

The report is reigniting the partisan divide over combating terrorism that dominated Washington a decade ago. Democrats argue the tactics conflict with American values while leading members of the Bush administration insist they were vital to preventing another attack.

obervantone wrote:Here is John McCain's take...but what does he know about foreign affairs or torture?  

http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/09/politics/mccain-lauds-release-terror-report/index.html

Don’t you know, pouring water on someones face is worse than beheading?




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News Hawk

Don’t you know, pouring water on someones face is worse than beheading?

Waterboarding used to be a crime:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/11/02/AR2007110201170.html

"Our enemies act without conscience. We must not,"
-Senator John McCain R-AZ

News Buzzard wrote:It's mind boggling that anyone could compare the stupid remarks by Gruber to the out and out illegal torture during the Bush Administration. Grubergate ended yesterday with that mindless investigation by Dayrl Issa!

You are correct, it’s not fair to compare the two.

First, Gruber spills the beans on what many of us already knew... Obama and his admin lied and intentionally mislead the CBO and the American public so they could pass Obamacare (while also calling American voters "stupid"), handing the GOP a HUGE PR gift.

Now, Feinstein and the Senate Dems hand ISIS et al the most powerful recruiting and motivational tool they've ever had.

George W. Bush authorized the CIA to do whatever it takes to protect American lives. We are fighting an enemy that prays nightly for the death of you and your family, and to whom death itself is not a deterrent. Sometimes you just can't be nice.

For the record… Obama still utilizes renditions so that prisoners can be tortured by others, elsewhere while killing unarmed civilians.
According to the one-sided Senate Dem report that wasn't even fact checked, the CIA supposedly tortured yet we know for a fact that Obama is responsible for killing innocents. Which is worse?

If the Democrats think the CIA and high ranking officials violated the constitution and the law then make indictments and lets’ have an open public court and put people in jail. But who are they kidding, this is all political show and the fact is the Kool Aid drinkers just don’t like and feel bad about this country. They can’t go after our military anymore so they go after the police and the CIA. They believe our country is deeply flawed, it’s all the U.S. fault.

It is very easy to go back in history and find things that were done wrong. This is an example, but post 9/11 was a time full of fear and uncertainty in the US. I am OK with what the CIA did and really could care less what "the Hague" thinks.

red_hill
It is very easy to go back in history and find things that were done wrong. This is an example, but post 9/11 was a time full of fear and uncertainty in the US. I am OK with what the CIA did and really could care less what "the Hague" thinks.

In essence what you are saying is that when something like torture is done to us, it is a crime, but when we do the same torturous thing to others then it is justifiable.   Do I have that straight?

"Our enemies act without conscience. We must not,"
-Senator John McCain R-AZ

obervantone wrote:

red_hill
It is very easy to go back in history and find things that were done wrong. This is an example, but post 9/11 was a time full of fear and uncertainty in the US. I am OK with what the CIA did and really could care less what "the Hague" thinks.

In essence what you are saying is that when something like torture is done to us, it is a crime, but when we do the same torturous thing to others then it is justifiable.   Do I have that straight?

"Our enemies act without conscience. We must not,"
-Senator John McCain R-AZ

What I am saying is that cruel things are done in times of war. During WWII, the US firebombed Dresden and many other cities in Germany, we firebombed Japan before we dropped Nuclear bombs on them. Right? Wrong? That is a matter of opinion. What I do know is that if we had lost that war, many people would have been charged with war crimes.

If a shithead from Kansas decided to get a group of his friends together and attack the tallest building in Canada, I would have zero problem with the Canadian Gov't torturing said shithead, US citizen or not, to find out if they planned more attacks.

red_hill
If a shithead from Kansas decided to get a group of his friends together and attack the tallest building in Canada, I would have zero problem with the Canadian Gov't torturing said shithead, US citizen or not, to find out if they planned more attacks.

Then that would make you no better than them, and MY America is WAY better than that. Again I quote Mr. McCain

"Our enemies act without conscience. We must not,"
-Senator John McCain R-AZ

obervantone wrote:

red_hill
If a shithead from Kansas decided to get a group of his friends together and attack the tallest building in Canada, I would have zero problem with the Canadian Gov't torturing said shithead, US citizen or not, to find out if they planned more attacks.

Then that would make you no better than them, and MY America is WAY better than that.   Again I quote Mr. McCain  

"Our enemies act without conscience. We must not,"
-Senator John McCain R-AZ

John McCain is not my arbitrar of conscience!

I don't see the point of ceding moral ground when the results of torture are highly ineffective!! Not a big fan of McCain but he served our country and experienced torture. Bush and Cheney did their best to avoid serving our country!!

What is up with talking about this waterboarding stuff again? I think it is a diversion for something.

You mean, coming out when Gruber was testifying?

You don't think that was a coincidence?

News Buzzard wrote:I don't see the point of ceding moral ground when the results of torture are highly ineffective!! Not a big fan of McCain but he served our country and experienced torture. Bush and Cheney did their best to avoid serving our country!!

After 9/11...

"In September 2002, four members of Congress met in secret for a first look at a unique CIA program designed to wring vital information from reticent terrorism suspects in U.S. custody. For more than an hour, the bipartisan group, which included current House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.), was given a virtual tour of the CIA’s overseas detention sites and the harsh techniques interrogators had devised to try to make their prisoners talk.

“...on that day, no objections were raised. Instead, at least two lawmakers in the room asked the CIA to push harder, two U.S. officials said.

“The briefer was specifically asked if the methods were tough enough,” said a U.S. official who witnessed the exchange.”

The lawmakers who held oversight roles during the period included Pelosi and Rep. Jane Harman (D-Calif.) and Sens. Bob Graham (D-Fla.) and John D. Rockefeller IV (D-W.Va.), as well as Rep. Porter J. Goss (R-Fla.) and Sen. Pat Roberts (R-Kan)."
—Truthout

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WHL wrote:What is up with talking about this waterboarding  stuff again?  I think it is a diversion for something.

Thirteen years ago, nobody was outraged at ANY means to prevent another fatality from Islamist attacks on American citizens.

Those with family members as victims would not have asked for less.






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The most horrifying thing about that picture was the total incompetence of the Bush Administration to stop it, after repeated warnings. The torture produced nothing despite all of the lies by Dick Cheney!

Absolutely true.....how many warnings did Bush & Cheney dismiss as nonessential info?? It didn't jive with their manifesto, their desire to conquer the middle eastern oil bearing countries.

Even Brennan admitted that EIT methods produced no intelligence that was actionable/credible.

News Buzzard wrote:The most horrifying thing about that picture was the total incompetence of the Bush Administration to stop it, after repeated warnings. The torture produced nothing despite all of the lies by Dick Cheney!

You really are joking, right? Clinton had ample opportunities to take OBL out. Each time his response was to willy nilly lob a cruise missile into some cave. Bush had opportunities. Everyone underestimated ElShitheads ability to attack us here as they did. Everyone. Hindsight is 20/20 and then some.