I see things have been busy since last I were here

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I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  obervantone on Thu May 19, 2016 1:07 am

The new boating stats are out

Let's review the NH accident rate now that speed limits are in effect to end all the problems.

2011...36 accidents
2012...40 accidents
2013...40 accidents
2014...44 accidents
2015...53 accidents

Yep, I feel a lot safer...a smooth steady increase.

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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  Amy B on Thu May 19, 2016 6:37 am

Sore loser
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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  WHL on Thu May 19, 2016 7:53 am

obervantone wrote:The new boating stats are out

Let's review the NH accident rate now that speed limits are in effect to end all the problems.

2011...36 accidents
2012...40 accidents
2013...40 accidents
2014...44 accidents
2015...53 accidents

Yep, I feel a lot safer...a smooth steady increase.



So the speed limit has helped a lot hasn't it! tongue
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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  obervantone on Thu May 19, 2016 8:56 pm

Amy B on Thu May 19, 2016 6:37 am

Sore loser
Just pointing out what happens when you base laws on fabrication and ignore the experts. A solution in search of a problem, the number of accidents have gotten worse....great job!


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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  Amy B on Fri May 20, 2016 5:49 am

As has been discussed ad nauseam, there were many reasons for the people of NH to want a speed limit, safety being just one of them. It is naive and intentionally misleading to say that safety was the only reason for a speed limit. I for one would be reluctant to go back to the days of boats roaring past me at 70 MPH while fishing or taking a small boat out with the kids for a ride. My Winni friends and neighbors are thrilled with the change in the tenor of the lake back to a family oriented destination.
Polls showed that the people of NH favored a SL and an overwhelming majority of our state legislators agreed. And contrary to predictions by the SL foes, the Lake's Region economy did not go down the toilet.

BTW...haven't seen any more of those high profile GFBL boat accidents on the lake in years. And no one suggested that a SL would stop accidents like fishermen falling out of boats.
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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  WHL on Fri May 20, 2016 7:20 am

You say the majority favored a speed limit? Is that majority people that live on, boat on or otherwise use the lake? Or is that people in places like Manchester who never even come to the lake? I would like to see that breakdown.
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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  Amy B on Fri May 20, 2016 7:32 am

Go to the Winnfabs site and on the far left click Lake's Region Poll.
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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  obervantone on Fri May 20, 2016 10:43 pm

AmyB
I for one would be reluctant to go back to the days of boats roaring past me at 70 MPH while fishing or taking a small boat out with the kids for a ride
Glad to see you are still repeating the same BS that got the uninformed to back speed limits in the first place...why aren't you quoting the Marine Patrol when they said "Speed is not and has never been a problem on Lake Winnipesaukee"...The BS won.  The Marine Patrol did a study of speed on the lake and IIRC the highest speed that they recorded ONE boat traveling at was 62...one time...not " boats roaring past me at 70 MPH"  which is just BS.

That same study showed the average speed on the lake was 23 MPH...
AmyB
haven't seen any more of those high profile GFBL boat accidents on the lake in years
Any yet the number of accidents has risen every year.

But, why let facts get in the way of good BS?

Lake's a lot safer now!   Sure it is!  

OO Out


Last edited by obervantone on Fri May 20, 2016 11:08 pm; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : I had written the average speed was 30-35 and then looked it up and corrected it to 23MPH. Far cry from 45 or 70!)

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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  WHL on Sat May 21, 2016 7:42 am

Good post!
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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  Amy B on Sat May 21, 2016 9:14 am

WHL wrote:Good post!

  observantone again intentionally dances around the real issues of this debate, namely that speed was just one of many reasons why the majority favored a change to the lake's boating laws (did you two look at the poll conducted by a national polling group?). The lake has changed for the better. And posts from offshoreonly.com that were shown to me help support the fact that some of the most flagrant offenders have indeed gone elsewhere. As far as accidents, no one claimed a speed limit would stop accidents like boats backing over skiers (this actually happened here on Winni!).
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Resorting to Catch-All Statistics...Disregarding the Increase in Tubing and Manic Jet-Skis?

Post  News Hawk on Mon May 23, 2016 5:38 am

obervantone wrote:The new boating stats are out

Let's review the NH accident rate now that speed limits are in effect to end all the problems.

2011...36 accidents
2012...40 accidents
2013...40 accidents
2014...44 accidents
2015...53 accidents

Yep, I feel a lot safer...a smooth steady increase.

As to "busy", FYI, this Wolfeboro topic has had 144 views.

Cool

No Winnipesaukee boaters have been killed by speeders for five years?

scratch

.
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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  red_hill on Mon May 23, 2016 2:32 pm

Amy B wrote:  
  BTW...haven't seen any more of those high profile GFBL boat accidents on the lake in years.


Can you tell me the last one?

I know of 3 new to the lake 38 foot performance boats for 2016. Bettah get your earmuffs!

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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  Amy B on Mon May 23, 2016 2:53 pm

We're not too worried. We have laws regulating noise as well. Razz
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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  obervantone on Tue May 24, 2016 1:23 am

AmyB
observantone again intentionally dances around the real issues of this debate, namely that speed was just one of many reasons why the majority favored a change to the lake's boating laws
Odd.  
The first sentence of the WinnFABRICATORS site  under the heading "Why Speed Limits" says...and I quote.."Speed limits and safety go hand in hand".

No more speeding boats, just a steady increase in the number of reportable accidents year after year.

Yep, that steady increase in the number of boating accidents proves it...the lake is a whole lot safer now.

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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  Amy B on Tue May 24, 2016 6:24 am

And even before that on the Winnfabs site:

Lakes Region Economic Health
Safety
Equal Access or Management


P.S. Can you give us a breakdown on those accidents?
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WAS Here...better

Post  News Hawk on Tue May 24, 2016 8:17 am

obervantone wrote:No more speeding boats, just a steady increase in the number of reportable accidents year after year.
How does the increase in "NH reportable accidents" compare with NH roadway accidents? I'd expect both stats are up, as more out of state "visitors" keep discovering NH.

No

Amy B wrote:
WHL wrote:Good post!

  observantone again intentionally dances around the real issues of this debate, namely that speed was just one of many reasons why the majority favored a change to the lake's boating laws (did you two look at the poll conducted by a national polling group?). The lake has changed for the better. And posts from offshoreonly.com that were shown to me help support the fact that some of the most flagrant offenders have indeed gone elsewhere. As far as accidents, no one claimed a speed limit would stop accidents like boats backing over skiers (this actually happened here on Winni!).

•​ ​​Are those offshoreonly.com comments available for casual/general public view? (Like before they learned we monitored their "proud" transgressions of nationwide laws?)

•​ ​​Just one boat in Winter Harbor yesterday afternoon, and the NHMP stopped it! Just which boat (of the two) had the barking dog is unknown, but does the NHMP allow dogs on their boats? The (big-sounding) dog was so insistently barking, it's possible the boater was let go—in spite of any transgression of NH law—because nobody could hear one another!
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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  Amy B on Tue May 24, 2016 10:54 am

Yes they are available to anyone online. Here's one I just pulled up (from last May):

"Thanks for the info guys. That lake is so much fun and has so many options, it's a shame "we" basically got run out of there. I remember seeing 20-30 offshore boats at any given time/day. "
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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  obervantone on Tue May 24, 2016 11:37 am

You can jump up and down and point to opinion post vs actual research all you want. The fact remains that the outcome of the feel good "solution in search of a problem" did exactly as most boaters knew it would. Nothing. Instead the number of accidents has been on a steady rise.

But then, you have never let facts get in the way before, why start now tongue

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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  WHL on Tue May 24, 2016 12:06 pm

And boating had been down until last year, partly at least because of the price of gas.
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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  Amy B on Tue May 24, 2016 12:40 pm

obervantone wrote:You can jump up and down and point to opinion post vs actual research all you want.  The fact remains that the outcome of the feel good "solution in search of a problem" did exactly as most boaters knew it would.  Nothing.  Instead the number of accidents has been on a steady rise.

But then, you have never let facts get in the way before, why start now tongue
 

But you still haven't given us a breakdown of what exactly the accidents were. Me thinks you are cherry picking your data. And speaking of facts getting in the way, let's review this one:

  Poll of Lakes Region voters: "Do you favor or oppose the current boat speed limit law?" Answer: 72% favor, 20% oppose. A better than 3:1 margin. Get over it. The people have spoken. I can't believe you have brought up this topic yet again, what 5 years after the fact?
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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  News Hawk on Wed May 25, 2016 6:53 am

obervantone wrote:You can jump up and down and point to opinion post vs actual research all you want. The fact remains that the outcome of the feel good "solution in search of a problem" did exactly as most boaters knew it would. Nothing. Instead the number of accidents has been on a steady rise.

We're happy that nobody else has been killed. Rolling Eyes

Did the Governor have any choice in the matter, when the champion of the "No-Speed-Limits" crowd crashed and killed a passenger—whose personal safety was the champion's responsibility, alone?

WHL wrote:And boating had been down until last year, partly at least because of the price of gas.

Not according to offshoreonly.com.

Another hint  drunken  of the effect:

You're right, back in the day it was a great place to go, but I wont go back until they lift the restrictions. I do not want to give them our tourism dollars since they clearly put the restrictions in place to keep "us" out, so the last thing I want to do is to give them a great excuse to pull me over after seeing the boat parked at the (sand)bar for the afternoon. No thanks, I'll spend my money elsewhere...

Isn't the (sand)bar a place to get drunk?

scratch

.
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Another from Offshore.com...

Post  News Hawk on Wed May 25, 2016 7:03 am

However, Noise is what brought upon our speed limits (loud = perceived fast moving) so...be careful and please don't ruin it for those of us who are here or frequently visit.

Taking their own advice—much?

No

.

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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  WHL on Wed May 25, 2016 7:19 am

Again, it was alcohol not speed that killed the girl in that accident, NH. Well, Erica killed her, not the alcohol, just like guns don't kill people, people kill people. Maybe we need to ban alcohol on the lake. I am sure it is coming. Course if they do that, as somebody else said, the sand bar crowd won't be happy.

According to the marinas, it was a very slow few years. Maybe somebody else knows something they don't.
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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  Amy B on Wed May 25, 2016 9:40 am

No doubt gas prices were a big factor. I'm told that the pontoon boats were flying off the shelves (racks?) and that those marinas who were able to take advantage of this trend did well.
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Re: I see things have been busy since last I were here

Post  obervantone on Wed May 25, 2016 11:49 am

WHL
Again, it was alcohol not speed that killed the girl in that accident, NH. Well, Erica killed her, not the alcohol, just like guns don't kill people, people kill people. Maybe we need to ban alcohol on the lake. I am sure it is coming. Course if they do that, as somebody else said, the sand bar crowd won't be happy.
We can use logic and point out the facts and inconsistencies in their fabricated statements all we want. It won't change their stand. It also won't Change the FACT that since speed limits...the solution in search of a problem...went into effect the number of boating accidents has steadily risen.

They will come up with all kind of excuses and blame this and that...the bottom line is, since speed limits went into effect accidents have increased.

What a surprise!

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